Let's talk about developer entitlement

[m76]

The mainstream gaming media cannot stop talking about gamers supposed entitlement, but let's flip the coin for a moment here.

When a developer takes an established franchise, and completely redesigns it to have almost nothing in common with what made that franchise successful in the first place. Are they then entitled to unconditional acceptance by the fans?

Why do they feel like they can make something that is completely anathema to every part of the established lore without getting any pushback?

And when there is inevitably pushback, instead of trying to sell the changes to the fans reassuring them that their concept is sound and it will be good, they go on an all out offensive, attacking fans on social media and in multiple publications around the mainstream media. What is this if not entitlement?

What are they trying to achieve? Who do they think they are making these games for if not for the built in core audience of the franchise?
Or if they feel they don't need or want that audience, then why not start with a clean slate so there are no expectations to begin with?

is this a deliberate attempt at getting hate based publicity, or are they really this clueless and disconnected from their own audience?

Edited August 28, 2021 by m76

[Shagger]

4 hours ago, m76 said:

The mainstream gaming media cannot stop talking about gamers supposed entitlement, but let's flip the coin for a moment here.

When a developer takes an established franchise, and completely redesigns it to have almost nothing in common with what made that franchise successful in the first place. Are they then entitled to unconditional acceptance by the fans?

Why do they feel like they can make something that is completely anathema to every part of the established lore without getting any pushback?

And when there is inevitably pushback, instead of trying to sell the changes to the fans reassuring them that their concept is sound and it will be good, they go on an all out offensive, attacking fans on social media and in multiple publications around the mainstream media. What is this if not entitlement?

What are they trying to achieve? Who do they think they are making these games for if not for the built in core audience of the franchise?
Or if they feel they don't need or want that audience, then why not start with a clean slate so there are no expectations to begin with?

is this a deliberate attempt at getting hate based publicity, or are they really this clueless and disconnected from their own audience?

 

Can we possibly have some examples of what your on about?

[Crazycrab]

37 minutes ago, Shagger said:

 

Can we possibly have some examples of what your on about?

 

I can think of a few, I'll start with this one:

 

4 hours ago, m76 said:

When a developer takes an established franchise, and completely redesigns it to have almost nothing in common with what made that franchise successful in the first place. Are they then entitled to unconditional acceptance by the fans?

 

 

 

I'll prefix this by saying I love Ninja Theory, but the changes made to this franchise and Dante's character in particular were misguided and arrogant.  I think I said in another how creators shouldn't let outside influence stifle their creativity, but this pushed it to far and an otherwise decent entry to in the series earned scalding from the fans as a result.

 

 

I'll just say it, Gearbox and it's CEO Randy Pitchford flat out lied about what this game would be and to this day use misleading screenshots and footage on the Steam storefront.  Don't believe me, even SEGA called them out!  Of course Randy Pitchford remains in complete denial and defends still defends it.

 

There's more than this but right now I don't have time, I'll probably post something later.

Edited August 28, 2021 by Crazycrab

[Reality vs Adventure]

I think they are trying to reach new audiences hoping that the fan base is loyal enough to stick with it. A good example is the Assassin’s Creed series, the new compared to the older games. The classic fans hate the newer games and criticize it not even being the assassin anymore. I like the whole series, but I’m that new fan base that completely loves the newer releases Origins, Odyssey, and Valhalla. After playing the older and newer games simultaneously, I can easily compare them. And there are some things I noticed in Valhalla that are trying to go back to some of the classic feel. And now they are moving on to reach another fan base again by turning their future games into online mode and probably multiplayer with the Infinity title. And that leaves me behind as a fan. But it is a long series and you can’t always expect the same thing. The theme is the same, but gameplay has had a lot of changes. No matter how much I hate what they are doing now to the series with Infinity, maybe it will be successful. I have some awesome titles that I am satisfied with. I don’t expect them to always stay as the classic or post classic. If they want to go new age, then let’s just see how it goes. I’m not gonna hold them down. I don’t like what they are doing and most likely will lose me as a fan, but I’ll forever be a fan of the games I do have.

In a way they are entitled because they have the right to do what they want. To take risks, to reach a new audience. They know what the growing target audience is better than we do. Money is what talks. Game developers is a business. They provide something to sell. Business means entitlement. It means you do whatever you want to increase worth. So when they do make changes and fail, it was a bad business model drifting too far away from what their target audience wants. Businesses have entitlement, but consumers have power. Success is when they figure out how to keep fans and reach a new audience. Entitlement doesn’t always mean they make the right calls. But they can do whatever they want.

[m76]

3 hours ago, Reality vs Adventure said:

I think they are trying to reach new audiences hoping that the fan base is loyal enough to stick with it. A good example is the Assassin’s Creed series, the new compared to the older games. The classic fans hate the newer games and criticize it not even being the assassin anymore. I like the whole series, but I’m that new fan base that completely loves the newer releases Origins, Odyssey, and Valhalla. After playing the older and newer games simultaneously, I can easily compare them. And there are some things I noticed in Valhalla that are trying to go back to some of the classic feel. And now they are moving on to reach another fan base again by turning their future games into online mode and probably multiplayer with the Infinity title. And that leaves me behind as a fan. But it is a long series and you can’t always expect the same thing. The theme is the same, but gameplay has had a lot of changes. No matter how much I hate what they are doing now to the series with Infinity, maybe it will be successful. I have some awesome titles that I am satisfied with. I don’t expect them to always stay as the classic or post classic. If they want to go new age, then let’s just see how it goes. I’m not gonna hold them down. I don’t like what they are doing and most likely will lose me as a fan, but I’ll forever be a fan of the games I do have.

In a way they are entitled because they have the right to do what they want. To take risks, to reach a new audience. They know what the growing target audience is better than we do. Money is what talks. Game developers is a business. They provide something to sell. Business means entitlement. It means you do whatever you want to increase worth. So when they do make changes and fail, it was a bad business model drifting too far away from what their target audience wants. Businesses have entitlement, but consumers have power. Success is when they figure out how to keep fans and reach a new audience. Entitlement doesn’t always mean they make the right calls. But they can do whatever they want.

In case of assassin's creed they ended up successful with the changes as those games are still popular. You can never please everyone but if more people are pissed than excited then they obviously made mistakes.

Of course they are entitled to making changes and trying new things, what they are not entitled to is automatic approval by players. But I don't condemn anyone for trying. A  long as it is on good faith. What I do condemn them for is when they try to blame the audience after a failed attempt.

I applaud devs who can take the criticism to heart and attempt to address the issues. But very few chose this road, even if it's proven to work.

I mentioned in my Terminator Resistance review that gaming sites no longer represent gamers. They have formed an elitist bubble and since major developers often collaborate with press, they think IGN or Eurogamer and the rest speaks for gamers, when in reality they don't. Maybe that can also explain why they think these changes would go down well. IDK, I'm just ranting. I'm interested to find out their reasoning.

The latest example is obviously the Saints Row reboot, where they tried to turn a game about big city gangsters into a game about desert hipsters. And I don't know where is that big audience who wants to play as hipsters, that is worth alienating all original fans for. They also said the game will no longer include any sexual humour or offensive jokes, both of which were trademarks of the franchise. I mean you could use a giant dildo as a weapon in them. And now they suddenly act more reverent than a monk? Is this pretence or they really think bland unoffensive hipsters sell games better?

[Heatman]

On 8/28/2021 at 9:49 AM, m76 said:

..... they go on an all out offensive, attacking fans on social media and in multiple publications around the mainstream media. What is this if not entitlement?

is this a deliberate attempt at getting hate based publicity, or are they really this clueless and disconnected from their own audience?

I actually think it's a pattern most of them all copy when things aren't going their way. Taking responsibility is one of their biggest weaknesses and I don't see it changing anytime soon. 

[Reality vs Adventure]

On 8/28/2021 at 3:26 PM, m76 said:

I mentioned in my Terminator Resistance review that gaming sites no longer represent gamers. They have formed an elitist bubble and since major developers often collaborate with press, they think IGN or Eurogamer and the rest speaks for gamers, when in reality they don't. Maybe that can also explain why they think these changes would go down well. IDK, I'm just ranting. I'm interested to find out their reasoning.

How are the developers supposed to get in touch with gamers if not the big gaming sites? A lot of those reviews from those gaming sites usually don't represent how I feel about games. Maybe developers should have their own fan based site and hope for constructive criticism. But I don't think it would help. Like everything, it would get overrun by irrational people. 

[Heatman]

1 hour ago, Reality vs Adventure said:

How are the developers supposed to get in touch with gamers if not the big gaming sites? A lot of those reviews from those gaming sites usually don't represent how I feel about games. Maybe developers should have their own fan based site and hope for constructive criticism. But I don't think it would help. Like everything, it would get overrun by irrational people. 

Exactly - it's actually a very big challenge because there is always a possibility of having biased opinions and also how our individual differences will impact one's opinion. 

[killamch89]

On 8/28/2021 at 8:34 AM, Crazycrab said:

 

I can think of a few, I'll start with this one:

 

 

 

 

I'll prefix this by saying I love Ninja Theory, but the changes made to this franchise and Dante's character in particular were misguided and arrogant.  I think I said in another how creators shouldn't let outside influence stifle their creativity, but this pushed it to far and an otherwise decent entry to in the series earned scalding from the fans as a result.

 

 

I'll just say it, Gearbox and it's CEO Randy Pitchford flat out lied about what this game would be and to this day use misleading screenshots and footage on the Steam storefront.  Don't believe me, even SEGA called them out!  Of course Randy Pitchford remains in complete denial and defends still defends it.

 

There's more than this but right now I don't have time, I'll probably post something later.

I was irritated about the whole Colonial Marines game because it was indeed misleading but what else could you expect from Randy Pitchford? He's a known scumbag in the gaming industry for lying all the time and being a dick to almost everyone who works with/under him. It must be said though that the DMC reboot has been the bane of my existence - as a dedicated DMC fan, I've never played that game and no one could convince me to do it because it was like a spit in the face.

[Heatman]

25 minutes ago, killamch89 said:

I was irritated about the whole Colonial Marines game because it was indeed misleading but what else could you expect from Randy Pitchford? He's a known scumbag in the gaming industry for lying all the time and being a dick to almost everyone who works with/under him. It must be said though that the DMC reboot has been the bane of my existence - as a dedicated DMC fan, I've never played that game and no one could convince me to do it because it was like a spit in the face.

Randy Pitchford isn't going to be the first or the last of his kind when it comes to gaming industry. It's a shame that when you look up to some of them, they all end up disappointing you completely.