Modern Epidemic

[Arcane]

Videogames today don't meet the standards and expectations of 1999.

the gross misconception that overcompensating redundant details for overall affluence is complimentary, has affected the quality of the entire industry.

sure there are a few prizes and not all aspects of the industry's products are faulty, but HYPE and Erroneous fawning have lead to a predicament. 

People who have no experience with how we got to where we are, seem to think that by FAWNING they are cultivating productivity, but are sponsoring it's stagnation. 

and it is stagnant. 

Edited July 16, 2022 by Arcane

[Shagger]

This is a gaming centric topic, so I'll move it to the general gaming sub-forum,

 

I have to agree. Games today just don't offer the kind of upfront value they used to with them being so incomplete. They get chopped into bits and sold back to us instead of being a simple, convenient one-off purchase. An argument could be made that games are larger and do offer more value for money than the perhaps they used to and and it would be true of a lot of them, but they're more creatively inept and so similar to each other that it feels like you're playing the same shit all the time, and that's before we get to the people who keep buying the same tired franchises year after year like COD or FIFA. I still believe that you can have amazing experiences with games today, maybe better than ever before, but it's so much work to find such games these days.

[Arcane]

just imagine how Good Halo Infinite could have been if no one bought Battlepasses.

they haven't even finished the menus. Your campaign completion, which is 1 of 2 unique parts of your 5 point PROFILE, doesn't even register. 

the Campaign doesn't even have choreographed conflicts, they re-orientating boss lunges, Impailers and mobs. 

Battlepasses and little Fashion Show armour paint, without teriary or secondary colours, has resulted in 343 industries completely dismissing any aspect of amending or completing their game, and push forwards with trivial tasks.

thats like how World of Warcraft, consecutively made the game less interesting, because people kept paying into it.

fawning is a form of degenerate fandom. 

[Yaramaki]

15 hours ago, Arcane said:

Videogames today don't meet the standards and expectations of 1999.

the gross misconception that overcompensating redundant details for overall affluence is complimentary, has affected the quality of the entire industry.

sure there are a few prizes and not all aspects of the industry's products are faulty, but HYPE and Erroneous fawning have lead to a predicament. 

People who have no experience with how we got to where we are, seem to think that by FAWNING they are cultivating productivity, but are sponsoring it's stagnation. 

and it is stagnant. 

I don't really know what to make of this since it's quite the mess of a post but i can agree to some extent, will probably have to quote it in a few parts because your post seems to be all over the place but it's an interesting one nonetheless.

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Videogames today don't meet the standards and expectations of 1999.

Maybe from nostalgia speaking they were, but that is just nostalgia for you while i have no problem playing a game from 1999 and get enjoyment out of it, the games i played when i was much younger when they were around still get my preferation then playing something new from that time period. Imo games from that time period haven't particularly aged well.

Also  when you have not much to play and you're dependable on what your parents buy you as far as games go, as a kid even a bad game you'll try and get the maximum out of it. Needless to say and i'll speak for myself i had plenty of time to play games in 1999.  Which i can only conclude with saying my own standard for games in 2022 is much higher then in 1999.

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People who have no experience with how we got to where we are, seem to think that by FAWNING they are cultivating productivity, but are sponsoring it's stagnation. 

and it is stagnant. 

People who are now getting into gaming don't know any better, so for them it's normal the way gaming is today. Eventough  a lot of gaming practices are shit shows only the minority seems to give a fuck i personally diden't myself either because i don't play multiplayer games well until some people here opened my ass what a cesspool it all is and you know what the biggest problem is that Parents don't seem to care when their kids buy skins on fortnite or spend it on purely cosmetic items. I've already went on a rant about this a few times so i'll leave it at that.

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just imagine how Good Halo Infinite could have been if no one bought Battlepasses.

they haven't even finished the menus. Your campaign completion, which is 1 of 2 unique parts of your 5 point PROFILE, doesn't even register. 

From what i have played of Halo infinite's campaign so far it's best Halo campaign in years. I'm not trough the whole game yet but it's on my to do list and from what i have played so far it's actually good sure the story may end up being a dissapointment but we'll see. Can't comment on multiplayer so i've got no idea how that is  but for the 22 bucks i paid for halo infinite to just play the campaign i'd say money well spent. 

[Heatman]

Gone are the days when creativity and uniqueness was the main initiative for game developers because it's very clear in what or how games used to be developed decades ago. All that have been swept under the rug for a whole of copy and paste of the same thing in another way. It's more about the money now than actually developing something that's really unique and worth what it's been paid for. 

[Arcane]

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From what i have played of Halo infinite's campaign so far it's best Halo campaign in years. I'm not trough the whole game yet but it's on my to do list and from what i have played so far it's actually good sure the story may end up being a dissapointment but we'll see. Can't comment on multiplayer so i've got no idea how that is  but for the 22 bucks i paid for halo infinite to just play the campaign i'd say money well spent. 

alright, so you cannot Compare 343industries' Campaigns for Halo 4,5 and Wars2 to INFINITE as if that's making a point. 

that's not a point/argument (definition of argument: the fundamental reason of a position/disposition; not, "to be indisposed".)

Halo 4's campaign was brutally undertaken by a new studio that had no money left and had to launch. They invested large sums in their cinematics, that was heading the HALO FRANCHISE in the right direction, but lapsed in basic in-game dynamics. That was the Setting Sun for HALO. Its final march: the lieu of it's grandeur.  {+ and they had "spantastic" (spandex*) multiplayer }

Halo 5 then followed with a complete SCRAPPING of everything Good about Halo 4, and tried to workshop the game up from scrap. 

now remember the difference between halo 5 and 4 was the COMPUTING PREREQUISITE. Halo 4 had 300% less power to operate with. and it was better than Halo 5 in all Coding Aspects and Mechanics, and Content Diversity.

People Bought into Halo 5 in spite of it being utter and complete Trash, and so that set a precedence: THE GAME DOESN"T NEED IMPROVEMENT; ITS A HOT CAKE.  

and then your multiplayer maps weren't all available in SOCIAL, they weren't even all available in RANKED, and there was no MAP PACK.

- in INFINITE YOU DON"T EVEN HAVE A RANK.  and it cost them $500 000 to make that game, and it's worse than Halo 5 if you get into the minutia and quality. -

~~~

 

HALO INFIINITE LAUNCHED WITHOUT:

- amphibian Warthogs, Mongoose, nor Scorpions. no Boats at all.... but w/e here.

- no duel wielding. NOT EVEN HALO 5 ARSENALS

- no hornet.

- the brutes weren't 343 INDUSTRIES OWN BRUTE RE-ENVISION

AND NOW PEOPLE BUYING INTO IT ARE PERPETUATING THE ISSUE.

BUT THE AI IS WORSE THAN HALO 4 STILL

~~~

 

you are comparing something that was designed for 800% less Computing Power than the XBOX X SERIES.

and it's still CRITICALLY worse, in ever manner except the 600 gigabytes of terrain VOLUME*, which in itself is 100% worse thoroughly.  and not because of the scale, but because of the craftsmanship and design and code.

Edited July 17, 2022 by Arcane
clarity**

[Arcane]

NOOOOOOOO. edit timed out... 

$500 MILLION. / $500 000 000.00 

** NOT $500 Thousands ** 

 

the Halo INFINITE BUDGET. and it ... yeah. i can literally do a 4 hour documentary with a hastened vocal dub, to surmise it's failure. without breaths, for NOTHING but to separate comments from points.  ( high pitched ranting for 4 hours without stop: that's how brutally undertaken the project was. )

 

~

 

just remembered... CRAP: 000

Edited July 17, 2022 by Arcane

[Justin11]

Games are sliced bit by bit and sold very incomplete, then update patches to make more money. What video game studios are doing is complete broad day light extortion. 

[Clasher]

Let's just say the game industry has evolved into what it is now, you can't actually compare the level of technology 25 years ago to what it is now.

We have 4k streams , virtual reality and you just play a video game and feel like you are totally a part of it.

Though there is still a lot more to be done and the game industry has made it more about the money now, but it's still worth it to  appreciate all that we have now as it has really been great playing some of the recent games despite DLC's and microtransactions trying to spoil some of the fun.

[killamch89]

I  understand what you mean by the gaming standards of previous decades has really fell off a cliff and most of us older gamers bring up that point every day. They keep taking out a lot of features of older games and try to sell us a shell of a product for even more exorbitant prices. Most modern games of a genre seem to follow what works rather than trying to provide a unique experience to its users. 

[Kane99]

Yeah, back in the day games came out mostly finished and ready to go. But these days so many studios have to release new games that aren't 100% complete, and they expect us gamers to pull the wait of testing and all that jazz. I wish games came out the way they used to, at least then we know we're getting a mostly complete game with minimal problems. Today we aren't always sure if the final game is 100% complete or free of bugs and problems. Look at Bethesda for example, I imagine their earlier games came out with less problems than their modern games. 

I think it just comes down to studios needing to make a release date, and they get stuck there and have to push and push to complete. When it should be that studios are given more than enough time to finish their work, and if not, give them a couple delays. 

 

[Withywarlock]

On 7/17/2022 at 5:15 PM, Arcane said:

alright, so you cannot Compare 343industries' Campaigns for Halo 4,5 and Wars2 to INFINITE as if that's making a point. 

Of course they can, and you're doing it in the rest of your post. What you go on to say is a testament to how good that game is for Yaramaki despite its measurable flaws. My complaints (and no small amount of gripes) with Halo Infinite are with the multiplayer aspect of the game rather than the single player, but I'd like to keep it civil all the same. If you want to act like this, the Halo: Waypoint forums might be better as your post is the level of quality for discussion there.

As for the rest of this thread, what exactly are we discussing here? Are we in the grief stage of only now just discovering the industry's been bad for decades, or are we in the solutions stage and want to discuss good game developers and publishers, and encourage better practices? Right now I'm just seeing an unconstructive circlejerk and talking about what we already know and perceive.

5 hours ago, Kane99 said:

Today we aren't always sure if the final game is 100% complete or free of bugs and problems.

Moving us into a solutions-oriented phase, the answer is and always has been to wait for those whose business it is to get games on day one to find out. Day One is the single most important day for a game developer, and publisher in particular. If they start seeing sales go down before people have had a chance to review it fully (which is another matter I've spoken about at length on the forum before), and they see this happen enough times we might actually get those more complete games. Impulsiveness and simply not knowing better are the reasons why that's virtually impossible today though.

5 hours ago, Kane99 said:

Look at Bethesda for example, I imagine their earlier games came out with less problems than their modern games. 

I'm afraid to say they weren't. I can't find the video but basically there were times where Daggerfall's procedurally generated content would come up with dead ends, which was sometimes gamebreaking because you couldn't reach key locations. Bethesda is its own worst enemy, and not even Todd Howard can take all the blame for that.

That's not to say that games were always like this, Daggerfall and others are an exception to today's industry where there's simply too much cutthroat business for better development practice to exist (at least in the AAA industry, and even then a lot of this is perception rather than based on any facts I have at hand, because getting said facts is nigh impossible).

5 hours ago, Kane99 said:

I think it just comes down to studios needing to make a release date, and they get stuck there and have to push and push to complete. When it should be that studios are given more than enough time to finish their work, and if not, give them a couple delays. 

Indeed. I'm loathe to say this but even my plans of trying to direct this into positivity are based on the just-world fallacy: that in a just world developers and publishers will strive to make a better game for all of us because they can afford to give their staff time to make a great product, and that people actually deserve such quality games because in a just world people no longer abuse developers for not giving release dates, or in general really.

Edited July 20, 2022 by Withywarlock
Further clarification

[Heatman]

10 hours ago, killamch89 said:

I  understand what you mean by the gaming standards of previous decades has really fell off a cliff and most of us older gamers bring up that point every day. They keep taking out a lot of features of older games and try to sell us a shell of a product for even more exorbitant prices. Most modern games of a genre seem to follow what works rather than trying to provide a unique experience to its users. 

Some of them don't have the moral standards to even develop and release what works even after selling the games at exorbitant prices.

It's why you get to see some game's be broken at its launch or release and why is that? Do they care about the money they take from the gamers in that situation? I don't think so. 

[Arcane]

the problem is not, that you bought a game. the problem is that they float on micro-sales. and people saying crap like Halo INFINITE's campaign isn't the shittload it is. ~ if you didn't buy micro-sales, they'd have to THEN FINISH THE GAME to get this budget back (spend money to make money).

SKYRIM was crapola (it had what?: 4 strikes? the same as oblivion? OH AND 2 SPELL HANDS! otherwise is was again less than Oblivion, which was less than Morrowind, which was less than Daggerfell (have you seen daggerfell: it has a notoriously large map).) . and u don't feel more immersed in the game than you did playing Morrowind, which utterly lacked vocals. that's just how invested you are in the experience as a general whole. Spyro the Dragon 1-3  is still a flawless game that you get right into as if HD graphics are for kikes. 

 

I should just do a big spiel on how HD graphics are incompatible with hardware, CPU's and INTERNET. but that can wait. HD is not compatible with Videogames: it's a fact.

 

Edited July 21, 2022 by Arcane

[Withywarlock]

5 hours ago, Arcane said:

if you didn't buy micro-sales, they'd have to THEN FINISH THE GAME to get this budget back (spend money to make money).

Which we've known for a long time and hasn't changed. What's your point?

6 hours ago, Arcane said:

I should just do a big spiel on how HD graphics are incompatible with hardware, CPU's and INTERNET. but that can wait. HD is not compatible with Videogames: it's a fact.

Please don't. I can appreciate that not every user's first language is English, and I hope that's the case here, but you've already shown here and in another thread that you're not really interested in discussion, just shouting matches (one-sided ones at that). You simply cannot say "it's a fact" for it to be so. Prove it.

I'm going to attempt reason here:

1. What do HD graphics have to do with the state of Halo: Infinite, its developers 343 Industries, and how they link to the rest of your posts here?
2. High definition is just an evolution of resolution, and we've already seen plenty of games that do 1920x1080 well regardless of art style and graphical fidelity. We've also seen lots of games that don't, but that's not because of HD.
3. How do you propose a meaningful, sustainable way for gaming to be compatible with "hardware, CPU's and INTERNET?"
4. Do you think people are going to change their minds by being spoken to in the way you have?

I'm willing to discuss these matters in a civil tone when reason and evidence of your claims is brought to the table. Until then, see above: this is just going around in circles about things we've known about for years.