m76 Posted January 30, 2021 Share Posted January 30, 2021 These days every major game has some sort of data collection built into them that analyses and sends information on your playing habits and in game choices back to the developer. How do you feel about this? I have to say I don't mind it if it is used to bettering games. I look at it as if a poll or questionnaire that you constantly fill. But there are also very bad examples. Like recently when a developer used this data to publicly shame gamers for their in-game choices. This is unacceptable. This is like the chef coming out of the kitchen in a restaurant and slapping the client in the face for ordering two courses that don't match in the opinion of the chef. killamch89, Family sedan and Withywarlock 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Withywarlock Posted January 30, 2021 Share Posted January 30, 2021 (edited) Telemetry, my dear Watson. Sorry, couldn't resist. I think actual user data can be significantly more useful than feedback forums for bettering games. Seeing kill stats, achievements, and other milestones can provide much more to developers than subjective experience relayed during a heated forum discussion. However, data isn't entirely reliable as achievements can be doctored by cheat engines and exploits, and anti-cheat can be bypassed or outright destroyed. 1 hour ago, m76 said: But there are also very bad examples. Like recently when a developer used this data to publicly shame gamers for their in-game choices. This is unacceptable. I concur. One such example is with Mr. John Ebenger, formerly of Mass Effect, said that only ~8% of users went into the Renegade content which they "put a lot of work into the [...] content too :(". If the intent was to shame it backfired, because statistically most people don't like being nasty even in video games and this isn't going to help. However I still found the statistic interesting all the same, and wouldn't have known that if not for them stating such on Twitter. But then don't try to guilt trip people into using the Renegade system; instead make a better system. One thing I enjoy is in episodic games you're often shown the choices players made, which sort of gives away that most choices don't matter. In Sherlock Holmes: Crimes & Punishment you can see the player stats at the end of each chapter, and they're suspiciously skewed to look exactly like my results which came from a guide for easy achievements. Hmm.... Developers and publishers must be prepared to accept that they can't know how good their game is until they release it into the wild. That goes for Atlus flagging Persona streams and Let's Plays incorrectly for copyright claims due to spoilers. That goes for Ubisoft having review scores updated after microtransactions are added. And that goes for BioWare for not seperating morality from social attitude in Mass Effect. By all means they can collect data, but they can't complain when the data goes against their expectations. Ours is a fickle demographic, and is all the better for it. I don't think we can escape data collection without turning off our internet, changing our phone numbers and directly addressing our mailing lists, but we can do more to be wary of it, and I believe there can be fights for legislation over what data is harvested, how and with what consent from customers. ^^ Edited January 30, 2021 by Withywarlock Sourced a claim. killamch89, Family sedan and m76 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m76 Posted January 30, 2021 Author Share Posted January 30, 2021 I don't think the renegade thing is that bad. I see it more as a disappointment than trying to guilt gamers. I was referring to this incident in my post but I didn't want to specify it in my OP because this topic shouldn't be about any specific case. The thing is that 90% of players will always go on the beaten path and miss things. Still that attention to detail which is only noticed by a handful of enthusiasts is what separates OK games from Great games. Withywarlock 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Withywarlock Posted January 30, 2021 Share Posted January 30, 2021 27 minutes ago, m76 said: I don't think the renegade thing is that bad. I see it more as a disappointment than trying to guilt gamers. I was referring to this incident in my post but I didn't want to specify it in my OP because this topic shouldn't be about any specific case. The thing is that 90% of players will always go on the beaten path and miss things. Still that attention to detail which is only noticed by a handful of enthusiasts is what separates OK games from Great games. My mistake, I'm glad you provided another example. Still I Larian's attitude it's as petty as Mr. Ebenger's sentiment of 'stop having fun via a means I don't like'. Before and after this I fully intend(ed) on playing a human, partly because of the racial traits which Larian seemed to forget are a thing in Baldur's Gate III, but mostly because I like humans and their possible impact on a fantasy setting. It ain't the fault of the players who made the "default Vault Dweller" as Larian put it if the devs aren't making a game with a property that utilises them well. When Larian pay me to play their game I'll reconsider what kind of character I'm going to make. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albertlovecandy Posted February 6, 2021 Share Posted February 6, 2021 I think user data is better than feedback for showing how the game could be better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Blackangel Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 I feel like it's an invasion of privacy. I want to play the game, not tell you what my nipples look like. Collecting information like that is going too damn far unless the game has specifically signed a contract saying it's ok. Not clicked "ok" or "accept". Signed, in ink, a paper contract. I'm not a fucking lab rat, and I refuse to let anyone treat me as one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m76 Posted February 7, 2021 Author Share Posted February 7, 2021 You sign it by accepting their eula. Which you must accept when installing the client or the game. Or in case of consoles you accept it on the first start or when you join the online service. Withywarlock 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skyfire Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 I am anti-microtransaction and anti data collection type of gamer. I hate it that even I have to use google profiles for playing some of the games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Blackangel Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 6 hours ago, m76 said: You sign it by accepting their eula. Which you must accept when installing the client or the game. Or in case of consoles you accept it on the first start or when you join the online service. I don't join online services. It's why I buy physical media and don't allow my systems to access wi-fi or any other online input. I block them from that for that very reason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shole Posted February 7, 2021 Share Posted February 7, 2021 It's good for feedback, and as long as they don't go overboard with the data collection it should be fine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heatman Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 On 1/30/2021 at 11:46 AM, m76 said: These days every major game has some sort of data collection built into them that analyses and sends information on your playing habits and in game choices back to the developer. How do you feel about this? I have to say I don't mind it if it is used to bettering games. I look at it as if a poll or questionnaire that you constantly fill. But there are also very bad examples. Like recently when a developer used this data to publicly shame gamers for their in-game choices. This is unacceptable. This is like the chef coming out of the kitchen in a restaurant and slapping the client in the face for ordering two courses that don't match in the opinion of the chef. Well, as long as such data are secure in their server or wherever it's stored and don't get exposed in a way it may hurt me, I don't have any issues with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
m76 Posted August 18, 2021 Author Share Posted August 18, 2021 11 hours ago, Heatman said: Well, as long as such data are secure in their server or wherever it's stored and don't get exposed in a way it may hurt me, I don't have any issues with it. Nothing is 100% secure, if there is enough incentive to hack it will be hacked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shagger Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 (edited) I never consent to collection of data for anything if I have a choice. I don't care if it's solely for the purpose to find issues, bugs, gather data on performance or in some way to improve the quality of the game and that's all, I'm not paying money to be your video game tester. Edited August 18, 2021 by Shagger Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heatman Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 1 hour ago, m76 said: Nothing is 100% secure, if there is enough incentive to hack it will be hacked. Seriously, it's actually why I don't blame those who are skeptical of leaving any trace of their data online. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
killamch89 Posted August 18, 2021 Share Posted August 18, 2021 Can't say I don't mind because I do - there should be a law in place that states that if a player's data is used for anything other than improving the game, the developers in question will be sanctioned harshly. I don't want any developer collecting my data for any reason at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
